Proposal talk:Free period products

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Word choice for key

The word "period" is vague. The preferred term would be feminine hygiene product or menstrual hygiene product. -Bkil (talk) 07:45, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

I have specified in the proposal why I don't like the terminology "feminine hygiene", but I'm willing to change it to "menstrual hygiene products". B-unicycling (talk) 09:04, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
You should consider submitting a new proposal to rename vending=feminine_hygiene to vending=menstrual_hygiene in this case. Bkil (talk) 09:33, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Exact kind

Why not provide for a way to specify the exact kind of feminine hygiene product available? -Bkil (talk) 07:45, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

How specific do you want to be with that? Strength of tampons/ with applicator/ no applicator? B-unicycling (talk) 09:03, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Free vs. payed

It could still be useful if it could be purchased at the bar of a pub for a fee or if a coin operated vending machine was installed in the toilet. I think we should map all three cases in a unified way. -Bkil (talk) 07:45, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

I had thought about that as well. But I thought that period_products=vending_machine + vending_machine=feminine_hygiene was circular tagging and also had the two different wordings, so I decided to put the "free" into the key. I also thought of period_products=free/fee, but one letter difference might make it prone to mistakes. B-unicycling (talk) 09:18, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
There 's toilets:*=* that could be used. But handwashing:*=* is already not following the format strictly. Tag:amenity=toilets#Toilet_equipment
However, in general they might not be given out at toilets only. They may be in other rooms. So this should be considered.
—— Kovposch (talk) 10:52, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
I had considered using toilets:*=* as well, actually that is how I first mapped the two I saw. But then I compared it to the changing table example and changed my strategy. B-unicycling (talk) 16:00, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
If it was free yesterday but became payed today, what kind of change would an editor need to commit? Would it be straightforward? Setting fee=no to fee=yes seems easy, but if a later maintainer that comes after you needs to look up the difference in tagging, that will bring an additional hoop to jump over. Bkil (talk) 09:32, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
A possible solution for tagging a pub that sells such items would be adding sells=menstrual_hygiene;condoms (or sells:menstrual_hygiene=yes, etc) to the amenity=pub
I wouldn't get tied up about the usual interpretation of a vending machine expecting payment. Such discussions come and go at times, but there is usually no conclusion. And if someone did succeed in proposing a new scheme for dispensers in the future, all existing data tagged with fee=no could be corrected automatically later on, so don't worry about this.
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:amenity%3Dvending_machine#No_coin_slot,_free_of_charge:_dispenser Bkil (talk) 09:41, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Other products

What if other packaged products are also available, such as condoms, wet wipes, mints, sex toys, toothbrush & toothpaste or floss? I imagine some countries might also allow vending over the counter medicine such as pain killers. -Bkil (talk) 07:45, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

I have never seen any of those for free, only in vending machines (not sex toys, though), and there is already a tagging scheme. But I had considered period_products=free/vending_machine before. B-unicycling (talk) 09:01, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Prior art

Please check:

The tagging based on this would be amenity=vending_machine + vending=menstrual_hygiene + fee=no. -Bkil (talk) 09:32, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

It's not terribly user friendly for the mapper, but that's what we do with dog excrement bag dispensers already, so I would be okay with that. It could be made easier with a StreetComplete quest, I guess. B-unicycling (talk) 15:58, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Listing multiple values

I found another, lesser used alternative, but I view that as an inferior notation as you should not include arbitrary words from an unbounded domain ("value-like strings") inside the key:

-Bkil (talk) 07:45, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

The problem is that vending machines often sell more than one product (I recently saw one in a hotel that sold TicTac, pads, tampons, condoms and something else.) They won't show up in taginfo at all then, because they are semicolon separated, and won't be rendered on any map, afaik. B-unicycling (talk) 09:21, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
On the contrary - if you check the taginfo page for vending and type in `;` into the filter box, it will return 131 pages worth of content. Semicolon is a well known and documented value separator in OSM and its use is only discouraged in case of primary feature determinants (i.e., `shop=pastry;confectionery`). Many data consumers already handle semicolon separators pretty well. If you know about a specific regression, feel free to file an issue in their bug tracker. Bkil (talk) 09:25, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Local defaults

You can find in the news various cases where the government had made it mandatory for certain kinds of venues to provide such products in their restrooms. In such territories, does it make sense to add this tag to millions of toilets all over the place? Just like how we don't map places where you can not smoke since smoking is prohibited along with quite a few other countries. Bkil (talk) 09:46, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Just because something is the law, doesn't mean it's enforced. There is plenty of smoke coming into non-smoking areas due to open doors, plenty of vapers in "non-smoking" pubs, on buses and the train. I don't use toilets in those places often enough to know whether they are actually following that law. But even for tourists who might not have studied the specific laws about providing period products in that country, it might be important to know, especially when you are travelling and your period is all over the place, I mean, irregular. B-unicycling (talk) 15:55, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

"Free" requirements, and limit on numbers

There's a service in Japan that requires you to scan a QR code. The business model is supported by ads. You can only get one each time from the machine, for a total of 7 in 25 days. https://www.oitr.jp/

So it might be best to have vending_machine=* / vending=* or dispenser=* for them. Maybe this will be awkward, but authentication:qr_code=* would be better than payment:qr_code=* . Eg vending_machine=qr_code would need to work out how it and vending=* are used. qr_code=* has been proposed and used for links.

In existing terms, it would be eg *:charge=0 JPY/7/25 days ??? Unfortunately fee=* can't be used directly with ease. Only fee:conditional=no @ (stay < * hours is somewhat common, in relationship with maxstay=* .
—— Kovposch (talk) 10:48, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Gender and where

Ideally location=* should not have its meaning changed in *:location=* . This doesn't work when provided in multiple toilets, especially female, unisex, and accessible.

They are not always provided in each stall privately and directly. It can be installed next to washing basins in the common area, or maybe even corridors publicly. Not to mention other rooms not exactly close to the toilet, as mentioned above.
—— Kovposch (talk) 11:07, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

I haven't seen enough of them to be the judge of that. Both mapped examples where one-room unisex toilets, to it was fairly easy to do. B-unicycling (talk) 16:22, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Use 'vending_machine' tagging instead

I love the idea and I totally see the need to map this. However, I would rather opt for the 'vending_machine' with 'selling:period_products' tagging with fee=no, as this allows indoor micromapping, is well supported and understood, allows for paid vending machines and allows to support other locations giving out/selling these products (e.g. an LGBTQ-center, pharmacy, ...) 18:21, 3 September 2023 (UTC)

Proposal cancelled

I will cancel this proposal and use the vending machine option instead for the cases I encounter. Thanks everyone for participating in the discussion. B-unicycling (talk) 17:39, 6 September 2023 (UTC)

@B-unicycling: Yes I would also recommend the vending machine option, in Proposal:Menstrual_products#Voting it is mentioned that you start with the vending=menstrual_products tag, I feel this is much better than adding a tag on the toilet so I would recommend consider opening another proposal at the same time, about the amenity (vending) of providing menstrual products other than toilets. (If it is provided for free as mentioned in this proposal, then add fee=no) What do you think? --快乐的老鼠宝宝 (talk) 06:37, 5 February 2024 (UTC)
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