Proposal talk:Millstone
Current usage
Just to note that current usage is minimal for either historic=millstone or man_made=millstone, so there's unlikely to be significant impact either way.
there is also some usage (11 instances) of memorial:type=millstone in one very specific region of Germany. Casey boy (talk) 08:43, 27 September 2023 (UTC)
- Thanks for highlighting the current usage statistics. While the usage is minimal, I believe that introducing a dedicated tag for millstones will help better represent and categorize these historical assets. I also conducted a search for millstones based on examples from Wikimedia Commons, and I found some of them tagged as historic=stone. It's possible that there are more millstones tagged this way, which further underscores the need for a specific 'historic=millstone' tag to distinguish them from other stone objects. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
There are many https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/1BzV tagged with name=Mühlstein. Not all of them, but some. Hard to tell though from the data. So, a distinctive tag perhaps warranted. --Hungerburg (talk) 14:05, 8 October 2023 (UTC)
Peak District National Park
This park uses millstones, usually mounted in a mortared stone block to mark its boundary.
. Additionally there are old sites where millstones where manufactured, such as Stanage Edge. SK53 (talk) 11:15, 27 September 2023 (UTC)
- Thank you for highlighting Peak District National Park and the manufacturing sites. This information reinforces the importance of documenting millstones. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Various comments
Millstones in or around mills
Resolved: I suppose that a millstone in a working or no-longer working mill, but still installed in the milling gear is not mapped separately.
- You make a valid point about distinguishing between mills and millstones. If the millstone is installed inside a mill, it is part of the windmill structure. The proposal aims to tag individual millstones rather than the entire structure. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
What about a separate mapping for indicating that a millstone is still in place in a mill?
- Currently man_made=windmill has windmill:vanes=yes/no if the windmill vanes (or sails) still exists. Perhaps an additional windmill:millstone=yes/no can be introduced to indicate whether a windmill still has a millstone. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
What about spare or damaged (difficult for a layman to tell the difference) millstones stored at a mill?
- I don't see the need to tag any millstones that are stored inside a windmill or other building. If they are stored outside the windmill, it might make sense to tag them only when they have been in one location for a very long time, not if they are stored there temporarily. The main focus for this tag is documenting millstones that have been in one place for a long time. That's also why I prefer the historic=millstone tag because millstones that are permanently placed in one location are usually of historical significance in some way. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Non-water-mill-stones
The second millstone example photo shows an animal-operated nor-water-nor-wind mill (the donkey is missing). For me that's a mill, not a millstone, albeit neither a watermill nor a windmill.
- You are right, that picture may not be a good example, I will change that. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Non-grain mills
Olive oil mills are frequent and in many places still operational. Some have millstones too.
- True, olive oil mills and similar mills are important too. The proposal intends to include millstones used for all types of mills, not just those used for grain. Millstones that have been used for olive oil mills and similar settings can also be tagged using 'millstone.'. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Number of millstones in one place
When several millstones are found on a heap, how do we map the number?
- Good question, how is that done for similar objects that can be stacked? Is there a 'amount' tag or something similar? For now I would suggest just using the singular historic=millstone. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Not all millstones are historic
Not all millstones are historic. I guess in many places there are still active mills using millstones. What about modern mills that produce stoneground flour - do they also round millstones?
- Millstones that are actively in use as part of a functioning mill machinery typically do not require the 'millstone' tag, as they are integrated into the mill structure. This aligns with the points you made under 'Millstones in or around mills' and 'Non-water-mill-stones. I was considering using man_made=millstone as an alternative tagging approach. This allows us to tag both historic and non-historic millstones, with the option to include historic=yes for historic ones. However, non-historic millstones are often either installed inside a windmill or temporarily placed. Please correct me if I'm wrong. --Mitsjol (talk) 14:12, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Rendered as
The main page contains the text "Rendered as: A circular brown shape with a smaller circular hole in the center of the shape". Is this accurate? Does any OSM-based map render millstones in this way? If not, I'd remove that line as it will set unreasonable expectations. SomeoneElse (talk) 11:41, 15 November 2023 (UTC)