Talk:Taiwan/Taiwan tagging

Language for road labels

I've been thinking about the language of the Key:ref tag a lot recently. My impression is that the average Taiwanese has problems figuring out what "TY59", "HC42", or "Fwy 6" are. So, I did a little survey among my Taiwanese friends and it turned out these English labels were indeed problematic. I asked for "Hwy 3", "PT91", "Fwy 6", "TY59", and "Youth Park Interchange" and the hit rate was close to zero. After all, the road signs I've seen exclusively have the Chinese version on it (or rely on shapes in the case of highways and freeways).

Now, the recommendation for road names is 'Chinese_Name (Romanized_Name)', which puts the focus on the Chinese name. I don't think the same scheme works for the ref tag, but to make the map easier to understand for the average user I would suggest:

ref=桃59
ref:en=TY59

instead of the current

ref=TY59
ref:zh=桃59

I think this would make for a more consistent appearance and an easier-to-read map. And renderers that prefer English could still get the English abbreviations.

Any comments/suggestions? I'll be happy to update the WikiProject Taiwan/Taiwan tagging page with the outcome of the discussion. (User:Mrubli, 2012-05-03)

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This has been a historic decision I made, when the osmarender renderer was still unable to display Chinese characters. In principle I agree with you, we can change that now. However, I'd like to discuss the ref tag for motorways and primary highways first. For tertiary roads we should indeed use the Chinese as default and provide the English one as additional tag. But keep the ref:zh tag for backwards compatibility.

For naming of National Roads (國道), we have the problem that we cannot render the plum shape. We therefor need to find a way to distinguish between National Road No. 1 (Fwy 1) and Provincial Highway No. 1 (Hwy 1). One could argue that they are rendered in different colors on the map and that that would be sufficiant. But I prefer to make the distinction more obvious. For the Chinese tag, we currently use ref:zh=國道1號 and ref:zh=台1線 respectively. Other countries with 'National Roads' or 'National Highways' use the 'N' in front of the number, e.g. in Switzerland. So, we could use ref=N1, or ref=N-1 for Freeways, and a plain ref=1 for provincial highways. We may even add a ref:en="National Highway 1" tag, for navighation software which reads the tags to the driver while driving. For the same purpose, we should keep the currently used ref:zh tags.

Examples:

ref=N-1
ref:en=National Highway 1
ref:zh=國道1號

ref=1
ref:en=Provincial Highway 1
ref:zh=台1線

ref=桃59
ref:en=TY59 (or even 'Taoyuan 59')
ref:zh=桃59 (for backwards compatibility)

--Mixmaxtw 05:57, 13 October 2012 (BST)

According to the discussion during mapping party:

ref=1
ref:en=Freeway 1
ref:zh=國道1號

ref=1
ref:en=Provincial Highway 1
ref:zh=台1線

ref=1甲
ref:en=Provincial Highway 1A
ref:zh=台1甲線

ref=桃59
ref:en=TY59
ref:zh=桃59

Saru 07:13, 13 October 2012 (BST)

railway=station or halt?

台鐵將車站分為特等站、一等站、二等站、三等站、簡易站以及招呼站等等級。個人認為，車站標籤應該依照這個分類。而招呼站的字面意義與 halt 比較接近，所以我以為招呼站應該標成 halt，而其他車站則是 station。 阿里山森林鐵路和台糖鐵路又該怎麼辦？

---

List of 'halt' stations --Mixmaxtw 06:04, 13 October 2012 (BST)

Why Chinese and English in the name field?

Hello! First, sorry for English. Now my question: I wonder why the name field contains both Chinese and English? The thing is, not everyone is a native speaker of English, so he may not want to read the English translation. Second, maybe he can read Chinese and wants to read the Chinese only. Currently, OSM seems to shows either Chinese and English or English only.

I wonder, if it is not possible for the software to let the user create his own display of the name? E.g., we have a name[zh], a name[zh-pinyin], a name[en], a name[de] and maybe a name[nan] (for Taiwanese). The user can then set in his options:

for Taiwan, display the labels like:

name[zh] (name[zh-pinyin])

or, if he can not read Chinese,

name[zh] (name[de]).

Or, if he wants to have the Taiwanese names:

name[nan]

The renderer would then only create the map, but the users pc would create the labels. Would this be possibly? I think, this would be the best way to offer labels, also for other, non-latin, regions.

---

That's exactly what the language tags are used for. The 'name' key is a fallback default which is used when the renderer cannot use the language specific key. Since the main openstreetmap page is unable to filter by language, I decided to put both, Chinese and English names into the 'name' tag. I also add localized tags, like name:en (English), name:zh (Chinese) and other languages.

It is possible by the rendering software to provide a filter for users to select which langauge they want to have displayed. This needs to be coded in the server software which provides the rendering. For the Taiwan's OSM server this feature has already been suggested.

Examples:

name=龍安街 (Long'an St.)
name:en=Long'an Street
name:zh=龍安街
name:zh-pinyin=Lóng ān jīe
name:nan=Leong'an ge (not sure about this one :P)

--Mixmaxtw 05:41, 13 October 2012 (BST)

The English street names in Taiwan are normally abbreviations. E.g. Yanping Rd. According to the OSM guidelines abbreviations should be avoided. Using OSMand as a navigation software I realized already that it can be annoying to have the abbreviated names since the TTS is not able to pronounce the abbreviation correctly. I wonder if this should be changed.

--Flofly 13:09, 19 October 2013 (BST)

---

I'm reviving this old topic.

I noticed that most of the major roadways are

name: Chinese (English)
name-zh: Chinese
name-en: English

(Let's call this scheme 1)

As a result, the mapnik render on www.openstreetmap.org shows "Chinese (English)", perhaps... to maximize accessibility, and I appreciate that. But Multilingual_names#Taiwan recommends

name=Chinese
name:zh=Chinese
name:en=English

(Let's call this scheme 2)

And it clearly contradicts with WikiProject_Taiwan/Taiwan_tagging. At least to me, this makes more sense. If we apply scheme 1 to all roads, bus stops, and buildings, the map is going to clutter.

It appears that scheme 1 was established before 2012, which predates Map internationalization. Now there are tools to display open street map in a specific language. And more non-latin-script cities use scheme 2 (Beijing, Athens, Moscow, Tokyo. Seoul has scheme 1). So is it time to reconsider? --Fosius luminis (talk) 20:29, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

I agree with Fosius luminis. --Proximus Locati (talk) 17:20, 6 April 2015 (UTC)

Is-in tag

On the main page it has been proposed to use relations instead of the is-in tag. While the idea is good, the search engine on the main OSM site doesn't support this yet. In fact, the proposal under which this idea was filed has been inactive for quite some time. Therefor, we can surely add relations and implement this ourselves, but for compatibility, please continue to add is-in and isin:zh tags to *every* street, POI, school, park and whatever else has a name which should be searchable on the main OSM site. --Mixmaxtw 06:41, 13 October 2012 (BST)

Add LRT tag rule for Taiwan

As title,Kaohsiung LRT is going to constructon soon. I think should set the rule about Taiwan's LRT --Kagami3421 (talk) 13:59, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Combining tag discussion on hackpad to this page.

Please refer to the hackpad page. --Liang (Wikimedia Taiwan) 16:07, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

縣市縮寫中英對照表 - 僅列縣未列市

「縣市縮寫中英對照表」僅列縣未列市。 Jidanni (talk) 01:04, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

梨山 ＝ Lishan, not "S..." yet

Without any Ground Truth, please do not cause e.g., 梨山 to have an S... word appear next to it. Yes, the government's aboriginal committee has a list of names, but you need at least one shred of Ground Truth before you cause tourists to have to encounter such non-used names instead of Pinyin. Jidanni (talk) 00:46, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

行政區域層級修定方案

因應民國福建省及台灣省在日常生活中已罕有使用，而直轄市、基隆市、新竹市、嘉義市、各縣，在日常生活中也以等同相同層級看待，但現時在OSM裡台灣各直轄市及其轄下分區的admin_level層級與其他縣市及轄下分區的admin_level層級有所不同，對資料顯示和處理有所困擾，因此建議如下改變台灣各區的admin_level層級：

	admin_level=
Country	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9	10
Taiwan (Rep. of China)	N/A	中華民國實際控制地區（border around Taiwan ）	N/A	直轄市（Municipality）／ 省轄市（Provincial municipality ）／縣（County）	N/A	直轄市的區（District of Municipality）／省轄市的區（District）／縣轄市（County-administered city）／鄉、鎮（Township ）	N/A	N/A	村、里（Village）	鄰（Neighbourhood ）

建議中改變後的行政區域層級階層圖：

border around Taiwan (de facto, 中華民國實際控制地區), level=2
縣 County, level=4			省轄市 Provincial city, level=4	直轄市 Municipality, level=4
鄉 Rural township, level=6	鎮 Urban township, level=6	縣轄市 County-administered city, level=6	省轄市的區, level=6	直轄市的區, level=6
村 Village, level=9	里 Village, level=9
鄰 Neighrboor, level=10

並把原來的台灣省及福建省省界改為disused:boundary=administrative + admin_level=3以作記錄現時這些省界已經未被使用的事實。希望各位能表達是否支持像這樣重新分級提案，以及支持與否的原因，或者其他對於這個方案的意見。C933103 (talk) 10:40, 27 July 2022 (UTC)

*註：對於市域分區、縣轄市、鄉鎮，應該採用6或者7或者8作為admin_level，也希望能夠提供相關建議。C933103 (talk) 14:09, 27 July 2022 (UTC)