Talk:Tag:shop=motorcycle repair

At the shop=motorcycle page, I've put together a proposal that tries to "catch" the various variants of motorcycle services (sale, rental, repair, clothes, parts, ...). I've used it successfully for a lot of shops in my surrounding. As the combinations of the services a motorcycle shop offers varies widely, putting them in different shop tags don't make a lot of sense to me. -- Ulfl 19:26, 22 October 2010 (BST)

I fully agree with the above mentioned, "putting them in different shop tags don't make a lot of sense to me", see KISS principle.

The existing entries should IMHO be harmonized, to enable frontends to use them. Lots of "repair" shops additionally also offer other services, so it would make more sense to use a single "main" tag with additional "attributes" (instead of a new tag for every aspect). This "cascading" way of tagging / categorizing is already wide spread in OSM.

See the "service" tags in shop=motorcycle (in use since 2010, motorcycle:*=* format since 2017).

Please leave a comment about your thoughts.rtfm Rtfm (talk) 22:50, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

The cascading from shop=car with service=* could be used. E.g. shops focused on repair shop=motorcycle_repair. --Rza31 (talk) 17:42, 17 April 2017 (UTC)

There is already a way to tag it cascading : motorcycle:repair=yes , see shop=motorcycle. The problem with "service" is, that not everything offered is a service, for example parts, tyres and clothes. If it's just scooter repair, you may combine it with motorcycle:type=scooter (also not really a service, but an attribute).

The question is :

• Is the tag shop=motorcycle_repair really useful ? If yes, what's the advantage over a main tag with additional attributes (i.e. shop=motorcycle | motorcycle:repair=yes | motorcycle:sales=no) ?
• When to use the one or the other ? (differentiation necessary)
• Does it generally apply to many shops ? (Most of those I know sell at least used motorcycles beside, usually they sell parts and tyres, so it's no longer a "pure" repair)

Also compare "Additional keys" in shop=bicycle Rtfm Rtfm (talk) 22:32, 17 April 2017 (UTC)

I dont't prefer a tagging. The additional keys in shop=bicycle are also possible. Shop=motorcycle_repair should be labeled as deprecated by this choice. --Rza31 (talk) 12:47, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

Yes it's useful. For many reasons. The least of which being that it is widely used and supported in multiple pieces of software and will probably have an icon in the main style soon (it already has one in OsmAnd). Other reasons are that it follows already existing established tagging schemes and doesn't create yet another thing someone has to search for due to tagging fragmentation like a namespace would (see Namespace "over namespacing"). It also allows for mapping of the repair place as a separate distinct node in cases where it is part of an actual motorcycle shop, but has a different entrance, contact information, hours etc etc (for examples see most Harley-Davidson stores in the USA and many other motorcycle shops). Which again is already established tagging practice, that we follow in many other instances (drug stores with pharmacies, convenience stores with gas stations, etc etc etc), and is a guideline. But sure, lets ignore all that and go with a namespace instead "because namespace." BTW, which would require multiple (or sometimes many) extra tags just to clarify that it's not a motorcycle place selling motorcycles. Let alone to add the separate contact details, hours, etc etc.

Sorry, but inventing a bunch of namespaces for their own sake and for things that already have established tags (plus guidelines about) in order to get around using shop=motorcycle_repair just isn't workable. Least of all because you'd have to have like 20 or more new namespace combinations for tagging same object. Most of which aren't necessary otherwise and that no one is ever going to adopt or remember. Just like no one ever adopted any of the other many namespace schemes for similar things that have been out there for many years in some form or another. While everyone is adopting new and more descriptive shop tags for these things all the time. --Adamant1 (talk) 10:07, 20 June 2020 (UTC)

BTW, it's also worth mentioning that these tags are vital in none Western English speaking countries and expecting them to learn a bunch of different English words and multiple tagging schemes just for tagging a motorcycle repair shop is extremely unfair to them. Most of the time, and I know because I've researched it extensively, they will just tag the motorcycle repair shops as shop=car_repair and name=motorcycle repair. They generally don't use namespaces for this. Even though it's mentioned in many articles and they probably aren't going to. Probably because it's just yet another barrier to entry that they don't have the time or knowledge to deal with. --Adamant1 (talk) 10:16, 20 June 2020 (UTC)

Services standardization

There's an easy namespace which covers all, but it seems the ID admins (once again) made it worse by introducing their arbitrary "service:vehicle" prefix with no standardization at all (also for motorcycle_repair shops). This has been mentioned twice on the mailing list when they were introducing it for shop=car, but nothing happened. Now have a look at the mess : https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/search?q=service%3Avehicle#keys

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No consuming application will be able to get the point what these "fantasy" tags mean. It's getting worse if one shop covers several vehicle types (car, motorcycle, bicycle) Rtfm (talk) 17:31, 2 April 2023 (UTC)